Are Mormans Christians?

[CenterPointEX]

OGB, We do not have to look to the Bible or the Koran to see which is more tolerant to unbelievers...

We need only to look to the nations that are governed according to the precepts of the Koran. In these nations it is illegal to convert to Christianity. The penalty for converting to Christianity is up to and including death. In Muslim nations there is no religeous freedom... PERIOD!

Now in nations founded on and governed according to the Christian Precepts taught in the Bible... there is almost complete freedom... Because it is a Christian Nation... America tolerates all religions... If we cease to be a Christian nation... we will cease to tolerate all religions.

There are over 100 verses in the Koran for instruction about Jihad... Folks can explain these into something they are not, but they pretty much in context speak for themselves... Here are a few examples... but first a quote from our muslim friend...

.You are confusing your self about who is a believer , in your view the Koran defines a believer as only a Muslim ....This is not true ...

the believers in Koran are men of all the three religions (the people of the book (i.e. Christians, Jews, and Muslims)...it is true man …

These are suras from the Koran...

5.51] O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoeveR amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

[5.14] And with those who say, We are Christians, We made a covenant, but they neglected a portion of what they were reminded of, therefore We excited among them enmity and hatred to the day of resurrection;... (Translation: "We thru terrorism instilled fear in them.")

[9.29 ] Fight those who do not believe in Allah…nor follow the religion of truth,... those who have been given the Book(The Bible), until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.

Sura [9.5] Slay the idolaters wherever you find them, and take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush.

[5:33] The just retribution for those who fight GOD [Allah] and His messenger [Muhammed], and commit horrendous crimes, is to be killed, or crucified, or to have their hands and feet cut off on alternate sides, or to be banished from the land. This is to humiliate them in this life, then they suffer a far worse retribution in the Hereafter.

[2.191] And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out from whence they drove you out, and persecution is severer than slaughter, and do not fight with them at the Sacred Mosque (the Dome of the Rock built upon the site of the Jewish temple in Jerusalem) until they fight with you in it, but if they do fight you (there), then slay them; such is the recompense of the unbelievers. (Jews and Christians)

008:012: …make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

008:059-060: [8.59] …let not those who disbelieve think that they shall come in first; surely they will not escape. [8.60] …prepare against them what force you can ...to frighten thereby the enemy of Allah and your enemy and others besides them, whom you do not know (but) Allah knows them; and whatever thing you will spend in Allah’s way [for Jihad] … 008:065: O Prophet! urge the believers to war; if there are twenty patient ones of you they shall overcome two hundred, and if there are a hundred of you they shall overcome a thousand of those who disbelieve, because they are a people who do not understand [Infidels].

003:169: …reckon not those (suicide bomers, etc.) who are killed in Allah's [In Jihad] way as dead; nay, they are alive (and) are provided sustenance from their Lord [meaning they are enjoying their 72 virgins in heaven and have earned the right to bring 70 of their family members with them];

They also get to take seventy of their family members with them... That is why Mothers of these children dress them up and send them to suicide bomber school...

004:094-095: [4.94]…when you go to war in Allah's way… [4.95] …those who strive hard [Jihad] in Allah's way with their property and their persons are not equal…Allah shall grant to the strivers [i.e., Jihadist] above the holders back (i.e. those who shy away from Jihad/suicide bomber school) a mighty reward:...
004:100: …whoever flies in Allah's way [forsakes his home to fight in Jihad], he will find in the earth many a place of refuge and abundant resources, and whoever goes forth from his house flying to Allah and His Apostle, and then death overtakes him [in Jihad], his reward is indeed with Allah…

Can this reward be delievered? Satan seems to think so... Matthew 4:9 (Whole Chapter) Click blue link to see Satans thoughts...

Koran :32.[5:32] if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people:
Chaaaw.

This Sura was used in a full page ad in the New York Times to say how peacful a religion Islam is... Only thing they left out the middle part... "Unless it be for spreading mischief in the land" That was purposeful... The Ad read:

Koran :32.[5:32] if any one slew a person it would be as if he slew the whole people:

The actual intent was a message to Isreal... behave or else! In context the Koran was talking about how Cain paid a price for killing Able... and if Isreal did not behave they would also pay a price... This Sura has nothing to do with the peacefulness of Islam...

[Orgnizdlbr]

So CP, you're telling me that Bible verse is tolerant towards nonbelievers?

The nations you speak of, Christian or otherwise, are, for lack of a better term, run by men. Men who are fallible, men who hunger power and more power, men who are motivated by money. These men, specifically who come in the name of religion, are the most vile and despicable of mankind. These men care nothing for religion, only craving things "of the flesh." They care nothing for the Bible, the Torah, or the Quran, but they use the verse of those books as a means to their own agenda. You and I both know that......

[Orgnizdlbr]

If you watch TV you see Christian aid workers being kidnapped by Muslims, you see people that have been kidnapped by Muslims beheaded! You see Muslims fly planes into buildings. Now, how many of these thing have you seen Christian's doing on TV????

Ben respectfully, your broad statement about Muslims was wrong. Are there followers of Islam who want to kill each and every non-believer? Of course! But, to cast aspersions on an entire religion because you view them all as radicals is wrong.

[ivanho]

The point I was trying to make on the differances...
Is there is no differance if you think about it..
Both sides have a belief in something bigger than themselvs.
I don't care if you believe in little green men or talking trees.
It's the ability to have faith!
I think it is the degree of faith that some have and others don't that makes us all unconfortable.

[LINETRASH]

Far be it for me to blast any religion.

I will say that my favorite episode of South Park delt with those forlks.

Who was it, Smith?

It was funny as hell how they portrayed this guy, reading stuff from his hat, etc.

Not overly religious myself, I adhere to the golden rule as much as possible.

Who knows? Maybe it'll get me a pass come judgment day.

[CenterPointEX]

So CP, you're telling me that Bible verse is tolerant towards nonbelievers?

Yes OGB that is what I am telling you... Jesus broke the Ten Commandments down to two... "Love the Lord your God with all your heart soul and mind" and "love your neighbor as yourself.".

Jesus was then asked "who is your neighbor?"... Jesus basicly replied that, "All men are your neighbor... even those whom the world and society despise... therefore... just as I have loved you, and willingly give my life for you... so I send you to take up your cross and follow me... that my love might dwell in you... that in you the world might know me."

This is the principle on which America was built... because of that we are the most loving, tolerant, giving, and caring nation in the history of the world. You will find nothing like this in the Koran OGB,

...These men, specifically who come in the name of

religion, are the most vile and despicable of mankind....

They care nothing for the Bible, the Torah, or the Quran, .....

The Torah is the Bible OGB... the Torah and New Testiment books preach the same message. That is a message of Love.

The Quran on the other hand teaches a completely different message... The Koran teaches a gospel of works... it teaches the message that man saves himself... Man will enter heaven or not by the works he does or does not do... The only ironclad way for a Muslim to know he is going to heaven is to die in Jihad... i.e. killing unbelievers.

The nations you speak of, Christian or otherwise, are, for lack of a better term, run by men. Men who are fallible, men who hunger power and more power, men who are motivated by money. These men, specifically
who come in the name of religion, are the most
vile and despicable of mankind...

This statement is BS... America is the greatest example that Christian Nations and the Christian men running them are the most compassionate on earth... Muslim nations and the men running them are some of the most uncompassionate on earth... By and far... the most ruthless regimes of all time have been atheistic in heart mind and soul... You have to understand OGB... if there is no God... then there are no rules... Yes indeed there may be democracys and dictatorships that make up rules out of thin air... but by and large... a democracy without morality will be as two wolves and a lamb deciding what is for dinner...

[Orgnizdlbr]

Preview
Quote:
Yes OGB that is what I am telling you... Jesus broke the Ten Commandments down to two... "Love the Lord your God with all your heart soul and mind" and "love your neighbor as yourself.".

Jesus was then asked "who is your neighbor?"... Jesus basicly replied that, "All men are your neighbor... even those whom the world and society despise... therefore... just as I have loved you, and willingly give my life for you... so I send you to take up your cross and follow me... that my love might dwell in you... that in you the world might know me."

This is the principle on which America was built... because of that we are the most loving, tolerant, giving, and caring nation in the history of the world. You will find nothing like this in the Koran OGB,

Deuteronomy


2:33 And the LORD our God delivered him before us; and we smote him, and his sons, and all his people.
2:34 And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed the men, and the women, and the little ones, of every city, we left none to remain: 2:35 Only the cattle we took for a prey unto ourselves, and the spoil of the cities which we took.

Yes, quite tolerant.....one of many verses in the "good Book" that speaks to intolerance...... This wouldnt be an example of killing "non-believers" now would it CP??

This statement is BS... America is the greatest example that Christian Nations and the Christian men running them are the most compassionate on earth... Muslim nations and the men running them are some of the most uncompassionate on earth... By and far... the most ruthless regimes of all time have been atheistic in heart mind and soul... You have to understand OGB... if there is no God... then there are no rules... Yes indeed there may be democracys and dictatorships that make up rules out of thin air... but by and large... a democracy without morality will be as two wolves and a lamb deciding what is for dinner...

Ah, yes, Politicians show compassion, captains of industry show compassion......Ha, ever hear of sweatshops? Compassionate men ran those. Ever hear of the robber barrons? A compassionate lot they were. And how about the right wing conservatives, those who rail aginst the murder of a fetus in the womb, a compassionate lot they are, for once the child is born the compassion stops, how you ask...the same people who rail against abortion rail against any form of social program of assistance, especially if the mother is a minority....give me a break CP, I thought you were smarter than that!

[PA BEN]

Passage Matthew 7:6:

6"Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

[Orgnizdlbr]

Passage Matthew 7:6:

6"Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

Not intolerant?????

[PA BEN]

Not intolerant?????

Passage John 14:6:

6Jesus said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.


If this it what you call intolerant. I guess I am.